A tale of two Chouts

The Ultimate Indian Motocycle Hybrid, the marriage of a vintage Scout frame with a Chief engine!

The Alchemist

The essence of motocycle, picture a rigid framed vintage roadracer, leaf sprung fork, single pan saddle, hand gearchange, foot clutch, left hand throttle and the biggest production Indian engine of the time shoehorned into the best handling Indian frame of All time! A true hotrod, the looks of a stripped down wall bike on steroids!

Sunday, 25 December 2011

Importing more rust

Lower half of a 101 frame coming from Ziggy's and a 101 headstock casting coming from Chicago.. more pieces of the Alchemist jigsaw

Tuesday, 13 December 2011

Forks n hubs

Indian 101 forks are very narrow.. not much space between the rockers, and the pivot bolts reduce the usable width considerably.
Today I tried a few of the hubs in my parts stash for size.. 741b Scout hub (above RHS) is way too wide.. about 2", a Triumph tiger Cub hub, (below RHS) is a tight squeeze but will fit, then I found what I believe to be a pre war Triumph 3T hub, same size as the 741b hub bit 1.5 " narrower, the drum bolts to a cotton reel style hub so it shouldnt be too difficult to narrow it further and then Ill be able to use the 741b brake plate, shoes pivots and cam tyhat I have in hand... saves cutting up an Indian hub too!

Saturday, 10 December 2011

Quality rust

Nothing like a piece of proper 80 year old rusty motosickle to cheer you up on a cold december morning

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Saturday, 3 December 2011

Pre 1934 Indian Primary Study

Indian Chief and Scout primary drive was by helical gears up until the end of the 1933 season, after which they were superceded by the chain driven setup that was used until the Wigwam closed in 1953.
The helical clutch basket gear/pulley is the same for all models and years up to 1933 with 84 gear teeth.
The intermediate gears were different on the Scouts and Chiefs from 1922 through to 1933.

Scouts ran 33 tooth front pulleys with a 36 tooth intermediate

Chiefs ran the same 33 front until 1932 with a 40 tooth intermediate to make up the difference in hub centre distance on the longer Chief primary case

My 1933 motor was a one year only special, the factory had decided the more powerful motor could pull harder and changed the front pulley to a 39 tooth lowering the primary drive ratio from 2.54:1 to 2.15:1 ...

This has left me with a bit of a problem and a dilema.. Problem is I have the 39 tooth front pulley, and I have the earlier type gearbox and primary cases c/w a 40 tooth intermediate gear. I don't, however have, the rare as DodoDo, 1933 primary set and intermediate gear to suit or the earlier 33 tooth front pulley.

Dilema... should I
Try and get hold of the earlier 33 tooth pulley and run 2.54:1 gearing?

Run a later chain type primary ?(not so keen to do this because I would not be able to use the nicer looking vintage era outer primary case)

Or... get a one off belt primary made that will let me run a 1" neoprene belt on a 39 tooth front and 84 tooth rear pulley with the rear one being a modified Indian clutch basket/gear?

Big advantages here, front pulley could be made up in alloy, reducing the spinning mass on the end of the crankshaft.. massively reduced drag from the primary and with some modification to the clutch pulley a bit of weight reduction there too.

The belts used in Triumph belt drive kits are suitable for running in an oil bath or alternatively the inner primary case could be drilled, the oil holes in the transmission bunged, the transmission clutch bearing fitted with a seal and the primary could be run semi open.

Picture below the 33 gearset alongside a Hayward Triumph beltdrive kit

Top cover is mid 20's Scout lower one mid 20's Chief

Friday, 25 November 2011

A tale of two Chouts

The steel arrived form Rigwood Engineering last week, enough 1.125" and 0.875" cds tubing to re tube two 101 frames, When I can afford to, I hope to get a set of frame castings from Moen at IPE and have Richi at Foss Fabrication build a second Chout frame at the same time as rebuilding the 101 frame I have. Richi is clearing space on the bench ready to make up a 101?Chout frame jig.

Yes folks.... TWO Chouts..

A road going hotrod 1940 Chief powered one and a sprinter/racer built up using the 1933 powerplant. These original 101 forks are on their way from Illinois

I have a spare top yoke/handlebar centre, and a pair of 19" steel rim wheels set aside for it.

This morning a little box from the Netherlands arrived with a 33 chief clutch basket, this will get modified to take a new outer ring so that I can run a belt drive primary in the earlier bevel drive type primaries.

Friday, 3 June 2011

Hot Cams

Just came through the post. These hi lift, offset pin, Shunk cams will go in the '33 chief motor along with S&S 80" flywheels and special alloy heads. This will be the "hot" hillclimb motor.

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Thursday, 19 May 2011


Just the primary to finish, need to order a set of nuts n bolts and a new chain.

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Late last year i picked up a complete '46 on chief transmission. It all looks good inside, some wear on slider gear and cluster gear but still a bit of life left in it! I decided just to use it as it is. I have a full set of new gears and shafts set aside if it needs a rebuild later on.

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Wednesday, 18 May 2011

Motor built

Headbolts to tighten down but otherwise ready for fitting in to the frame, will start on the transmission tomorrow 8-)

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Tuesday, 17 May 2011

Back on the motor build

A couple of helicoils for the transmission studs done, cases back together, flushed out and re oiled the crank, fitted the pinion, followers, lifters and set the cam timing. I fitted the cylinders without the pistons and set the tappets tight, getting full lift and no coilbind now using new 741b Scout springs

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Monday, 4 April 2011

Wheelin and Dealin, now we're rollin

Two Indian frames head south and a box of fork arrives from Germany. add a pair of wheels and we're rolling

Light Headed

A busy weekend getting the Sport Scout running and rideable, but at the same time my good mate Grizzy came north bearing Chout parts 8o) ........... the bits i'm most excited about are a pair of ultra rare 1933 spec alloy heads, one set of only 3 sets made. head on the left is standard cast iron, one on the right cast alloy

Friday, 11 March 2011

More pieces of the jigsaw

Stainless steering head bearings and modified 101 top yoke

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Tuesday, 8 March 2011

Peek seals

Custom cut to suit the alloy manifold that came with my '33 motor ready to fit to the '40 motor

Sunday, 27 February 2011

Cylinder comparison

On the left we have the heavyweight contender, 1940 on Chief cylinder weighing in at a massive 12.1kg on the right we have the mediumweight contender 1933 Chief cylinder weighing in at a considerably less portly 6.5kg. Multiply that by two cylinders - thats a massive weight gain in seven years!!!!

Wednesday, 2 February 2011

Thats a relief

Had a quiet night in tonight, and got the oil scraper relief cut out, a little dressing with the file and it's ready to put back together

Tuesday, 25 January 2011

Cases split

Cam follower post replaced, still to do some relief work for the late 40's spec oil scraper conversion and helicoil two of the transmission mounting threads then I can get it back together again.

Another piece of the jigsaw

A small box arrived from North Judson Indiana in the USA this morning, clutch hub for a Chief transmission, one mor part ticked off the need list 80)

Its not the fastest way to piece together a one off special, but I aint in no hurry!

Saturday, 15 January 2011

Back on the motor build..........

or, to be more truthful stripping it down again so I can sort out a couple of issues. I need to replace one cam follower post, also want to do the late model Chief oil scraper conversion. Sometimes, the only way forward is a couple of steps back!

Thursday night I picked up my newly made timing pinion puller from Richi Foss's workshop, made to drawings done based on Neil's pinion puller. Pinion off now, ready to split the cases

Tuesday, 11 January 2011

Mesinger seat arrived from Germany this morning

A very nice piece of kit, will need a sub frame made up fitted then broken in to shape

The pictures below supplied by Ray via Grizzy, show the subframe components and how they go together

Saturday, 1 January 2011

The Gathering

New Years Day, time to look forward to the new year and plan ahead..... take stock and see whats needed to bring the plan together.

frame...... in hand with Mr Foss for alterations
motor........ nearly there, should be together in the next week or so
transmission........... in hand ready to rumble
primary......... in hand
tanks........ two options both in hand
forks......... on order, due sometime this month
seat......... just ordered, expected very soon
wheels......... in hand built braked and ready to go


Messinger No 3

Just ordered mine from http://www.geloman.de/index.html